thirteenth rune; frost; video

[deadelfwalking]

[Hello, friends. A cold-eyed elf with a fairly significant skin condition stares at the camera, his jaw set, his mouth a thin, inscrutable line.]

Talk of a council is all well and good, but we have another matter in front of us.

As many of you have pointed out, there is no formal system of law in place. At present, those of you who acted as peace officers have simply continued as you were in your own worlds. If you brought others to justice, if you spoke about justice -- you have continued to see this as your right.

[His eyes narrow, drawing his long eyebrows together.]

But it is not your right. Your laws are not universal. Your morality is not sacrosanct.

We must decide on appropriate conduct as a whole, with consideration given to perspectives outside of our own.

I propose that any code we settle on be simple and direct. For example:

1. Murder shall be abolished. In the case of murder, execution.

2. Theft shall be abolished. In the case of theft, the hand shall be cut off at the wrist. Repeat offenders shall lose both hands.

3. Conspiring with the United Earth shall be considered treason. In the case of treason, suspected or actual, execution.

4. Bodily autonomy shall be respected. Knowing efforts to mind control, telepathically invade, steal, or otherwise forcibly take spiritual or physical authority over another sentient being will constitute assault. In the case of this assault, execution.

And so forth.  These are merely ideas, of course.

[His lower lip twitches, suggesting that he's perfectly aware of the extremes he's recommended. Suggesting that he's just trying to get your attention, to get you to think about how you would define your own terms. What constitutes murder? Theft? Conspiracy? Justice? He's only asking.

Maybe.]

[After several hours, the post is edited with a very carefully recorded text attachment.]

Proposed countermeasures to theft:
public humiliation 
fines
time locked away

Proposed countermeasures to murder:
temporary exile
(where?  to a safe place?  to a random location in time?

General countermeasures
better jail system (?)
compassion (???)
mercy (???)
trials (how?  who receives authority?  who takes what position?  what verdicts should result?)
jail time (general solution?)
punishment via the VR room (?) 

Comments

[deadelfwalking]

If the object did not belong to them in the first place, it is not theft. Obviously.

As to the rest, that was about what I expected from you.

[moralperil]

I think that must mean you know me pretty well, and I'll be glad for that! [A smile. That's... typical Mahdi, inventing a silver lining. It's not like Mahdi is shy about hir Pollyanna bullshit, after all.]

Anyway, it's interesting that you made this post. It's kind of an attractive idea to say, "Yeah, the people who do wrong will be put down forever." I don't think it works in practice, though, because it kind of assumes the people passing judgment are always gonna be right. Seems like more trust than you'd usually put in people!

Another thought... if you cut off someone's hand for stealing, then they're going to have a lot harder time getting along in life. They'll be traumatized, and people will treat them differently, too. So isn't that just creating someone who's even more likely to steal and harm others? And if we're gonna condemn someone to that kind of pain and basically set them up to fail later, why not just kill them?

[deadelfwalking]

It does not work in practice, here. We have resurrection. That is beside the point. The point is: if you disagree, what do you suggest.

[moralperil]

Have I been raised to the rank of someone whose opinion on this stuff matters without knowing about it? [A small, surprisingly sarcastic laugh.]

[deadelfwalking]

All of our opinions matter, Mahdi.

[moralperil]

[quietly] I don't think it's my place to tell people how we should be doing this. I have some good examples of how it shouldn't be done, but that doesn't mean I know a better way.

Anything I'd think of would depend on appealing to people's better natures. Assuming that at some point, somewhere along the line, that we could come to the same conclusions and agree on what constitutes the truth and a fair consequence. I don't think that's possible. There's no infallible law, but we can't just expect people to behave reasonably either.

[deadelfwalking]

If it's not your place, then whose place is it? And fair consequence is the matter at stake. We seem to have no system in place for deciding that.

[moralperil]

Someone smarter than me, who knows how this stuff is supposed to work! I don't have the kind of opinion people want to listen to anyway! I'm just another idiot who's lost their way here! [Hir voice is raised, pitched, but perilously close to angry. Mahdi pulls it back after a moment of silence.]

There's... simply no justice in this situation, so for us to pretend that we can find it here, is... it doesn't sit right with me. We're prisoners. Many of us have been harmed frequently by the UE, or on missions, and traumatized by that, even if we act like it's not a big deal. Justice would be to let us all go home and live out the lives we were probably supposed to have. No one is their best self here. People are frightened, hurting, maybe even losing a grip on their sanity because they're stuck here. Or they were all these things in the first place and being here made it worse. I have trouble blaming them for them for what happened even if what they did was wrong. Victims of abuse act out in ways that harm themselves and others, but it's not because they're a bad person or they're criminals. What happened was a symptom, not the sickness. It's not them who are wrong, but the situation.

[A pause.] I'm a little scared that makes me sound like a sympathizer. It's not good to be on the wrong side of the ruling opinion.